Adnkronos (Adnkronos) –
“Quando parlo io dico quello che penso io”. Botta e risposta tra Marco Travaglio e Gad Lerner sul tema della guerra in Ucraina, Donald Trump e Vladimir Putin. Nell’ultima puntata di Accordi e Disaccordi, le posizioni dei due giornalisti si mostrano antitetiche. Il quadro si sviluppa attorno all’accordo tra Washington e Mosca sulla fornitura di gasolio russo agli Usa.
“Sento dire che Putin non vuole negoziare. Ma cosa c’è andato a fare un anno fa in Alaska, quando ha incontrato Trump? Hanno negoziato un’accordo di pace tra russi e americani. E’ un’ottima notizia per noi, se non altro è più improbabile la Terza guerra mondiale tra Russia e Stati Uniti”, dice Travaglio. “Trovi?”, chiede Lerner.
“Purtroppo -continua Travaglio- noi europei siamo ancora in guerra con la Russia, cioè con quello che era il nemico degli americani prima che arrivasse Trump. E quindi il paradosso è che noi patiremo le peggiori conseguenze dei rincari energetici. Intanto, anche se non è granché il quantitativo di gasolio che hanno contrattato Putin e Trump, un po’ riuscirà a far ridurre i prezzi.
Trump ogni tanto deve ricordarsi di essere partito dal sovranismo, ogni tanto deve anche occuparsi degli interessi degli americani, anche perché gli americani sono chiamati a votare tra poco”.
The Ukraine issue is ending badly, as was largely predictable, because the Americans no longer give a damn about their enemy, Russia. Imagine if they care about Ukraine, which has no natural resources. And the few that do exist, the Americans have already got their hands on them with the deal Trump struck with Zelensky early on regarding minerals and rare earths: if they have any, they'll take them. As for the rest, the war will end by exhaustion, since it won't end with negotiations. But this, let's say, is primarily the responsibility of the Europeans who got in the way,” Travaglio continues.
"Europe's fault? Not bad," Lerner interjects. "We've seen how many deaths and how many wars there have been since Putin and Trump met in Alaska. We've seen how the war has spread around the world..." Lerner says. "I don't care now about who's to blame, but I care about the caricature of the two pacifists, Trump and Putin, meeting in Alaska and then phoning each other and making trade deals on diesel fuel while Europe is a warmonger... It's a caricature I couldn't get used to for a year and a half, and I'm even less inclined to get used to after Venezuela and Iran," he continues. "And meanwhile," Lerner concludes, "Putin continues his war with Ukraine undaunted, which is also being responded to with Western weapons. I'd like to see who in his place wouldn't respond. So this idea of a peace agreement between Putin and Trump, from which we were supposed to benefit, I hoped had been overcome."
“But you know, when you speak you say what you think, when I speak I say what I think,” Travaglio continues. For me, it's always good news when major powers talk to each other and don't shoot at each other. Whether it's Kennedy and Khrushchev when they defused the crisis that threatened to lead to nuclear war with Cuban missiles, or these two gentlemen. Of course, I never thought they were pacifists: they're two people talking to each other. As long as there's a common thread between Moscow and Washington, a famous red line that has fortunately been reactivated, the fact that Moscow and Washington are talking to each other is reassuring to me, given that they're caught between two nuclear powers that could trigger World War III. And I think the fact that they're exchanging energy is the bare minimum in a situation like this. We're the idiots who pretend to refuse energy from autocracies, seeing as we buy it from Azerbaijan, a country the European Parliament has labeled the perpetrator of ethnic cleansing against a people who suffered genocide, namely the Armenians,” he concludes.
international/foreign
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